Thursday, November 10, 2011

VMFA and Confederate History

What's going on?
Confederate Memorial Chapel

In recent weeks a group calling itself Virginia Flaggers has undertaken a campaign asking that the Virginia Museum of Fine Arts mount Confederate battle flags on the Confederate Memorial Chapel. The endeavor has included demonstrations on site, blog postings, and contact with patrons, legislators, and media. The museum administration has recently met with a representative of this group to hear issues and opinions, to share its ongoing commitment to interpretation and stewardship of the Chapel, and to decline respectfully this request.

In preparation for the commemoration of the Civil War Sesquicentennial, the museum undertook extensive research into the history of the grounds. A review of documents and images dating back to the time of the Soldiers’ Home (1885–1941)—and through subsequent decades after the Commonwealth assumed full ownership of the property in 1941—reveals that no flags hung from the Chapel. Battle flags were mounted on the facade when Lee Jackson Camp, No. 1, Sons of Confederate Veterans (SCV), began leasing the chapel in 1993. When renewing that lease in June 2010 and following a unanimous vote of its board of trustees, VMFA asked that the flags be removed—an effort that returned the historic structure to its original appearance. 

Historic Interpretation
The museum takes seriously its responsibility, granted by the Commonwealth, to preserve the chapel and its place in postbellum history and has devoted extensive funding toward its care and maintenance. Moreover, VMFA is not only aware of the history of its grounds and period buildings (which include Robinson House and the former Home for Needy Confederate Women), but actively interprets the compelling story of the Robert E. Lee Camp, No. 1, through public tours, a link on its website, and outdoor signage. 

In addition to the state historical marker and a bronze sign designating the site as the Confederate Memorial Park that VMFA placed on the grounds in the 1950s, three new illustrated signs were recently installed that mention this designation and tell the story of the Soldiers’ Home.  A fourth sign near the Chapel, facing Grove Avenue, interprets the Confederate national flag. Before installation, the text and images for these panels were reviewed by leading Civil War scholars as well as representatives of Lee Jackson Camp, No. 1, SCV.

Confederate history and emblems are currently well represented at the Virginia Historical Society and the United Daughters of the Confederacy headquarters, institutions also situated on the grounds of the former Soldiers’ Home. The Confederate national flag is flown daily at the front of the United Daughters of the Confederacy building, and Confederate battle and national flags are currently displayed within the Chapel, where their historical significance is interpreted by local representatives of Lee Jackson Camp, No. 1. In direct response to requests by the Sons of Confederate Veterans, VMFA also installed a flag pole in front of the Chapel, where the Virginia state flag is flown. As is protocol for State agencies, it flies tandem with the flag of the United States of America.

In summary
As VMFA fulfills its primary mission to serve the Commonwealth as a world-class fine arts museum, it will continue to interpret the history of its grounds respectfully and accurately. With many members, patrons, trustees, and staff who share the heritage of the Old Dominion—including those with ancestors who fought for the Confederacy—we share the same interest in honoring those Virginians who gave their lives during that brutal conflict and will do our best to preserve an important part of Virginia’s history. 


800pound_elephant said...

At the end of the day I enjoy standing out there and seeing our beloved flags in many numbers on the blvd. I like the fact they are in front of the museum and not tucked behind where only people driving down Grove ave can see.

I like educating people that ask what is going on as they walk down the sidewalk and i REALLY enjoy it when someone who was going to go into the museum decides they no longer want to go inside after they hear how the VMFA has conducted themselves concerning OUR chapel.

VMFA you have broken laws and we intend on seeing to it that you dont get away with it. We arent the politically correct UDC people who kiss your feet.. Quite the opposite. Remember at the end of the day you started all this.

We aren't going away. We will be out there in the rain heat and cold. When the tour buses pull in and when the school buses full of kids have their field trips..

C.C. said...


FireEater said...

You first have to remember that this entire grounds was designated a Confederate Memorial Park by law. There was a flag pole on the grounds that flew the Confederate Battle flag. You probably have a building currently sitting on that exact spot today, To come out and say you find no evidence of a flag specifically at the chapel has no significance whatsoever. You say you aim for historical accuracy? Then why is the stars and stripes flying in front of the chapel.The only flag that should be flown are the Virginia flag and the Confederate flag.
Please honor these veterans on their special day.
Return the flag.

Grow Up People said...

Thank you VMFA. I support you 100%.

Initimidation from these "flaggers" should never be a reason to vear from what you know is historically correct, not to mention that it is the right thing to do since the confederate battle flag is a symbol of hatred to so many.

800pound_elephant said...

Since the battle flag wasn't hi-jacked by the KKK until 1941 and their first choice of flag in 1919 when their picture was taken marching down Pennsylvania ave was American flags, then I suggest that flag is a flag of hate and it need to be ban as well correct?

It doesn't matter because I think they look so much pretty being flow right out front. ..and there is nothing anyone can do about it..

Susan Hathaway said...

"Intimidation"? Please explain to us exactly what part of educating people and discussing the situation with the public is considered "intimidation". I challenge you to present ONE SHRED of evidence of "intimidation" in our actions thus far.

Thank you, however, for touching on the REAL reason the flags were removed. "since the confederate battle flag is a symbol of hatred to so many". Funny, that is not what most of the people we talk to think...

You can shout "historical accuracy" all you want, but we all know the real reason the flags came down is because someone decided they MIGHT offend someone else.

SHAME on the VMFA and the Commonwealth of Virginia for turning its back on American Veterans and bowing at the altar of political correctness.

Put the flags back on the Chapel, where they belong.

Susan Hathaway said...

"When renewing that lease in June 2010 and following a unanimous vote of its board of trustees, VMFA asked that the flags be removed—an effort that returned the historic structure to its original appearance."


Was the green tin roof there in 1892?
Was the signage, the brick trimmed flower bed?

No, but there were Confederate Battle Flags flying on the grounds.

Was the metal handicapped ramp there?
Were the stained glass windows there in 1892?

No, but there was some oak trees that are gone

Seems to me what we have here is a case of "SELECTIVE" historical accuracy...

Virginia pride said...

The argument keeps shifting from Hathaway’s spun tale about old soldiers putting battle flags on chapel in the 1880s. Not true. And then she posts reunion picture from 1930s of vets with flag at base of camp's pole by hospital (which if you even bother to look at the newspaper picture of the 1890s posted earlier, has an American was flying). That flagpole was on today's property of the Daughters of the Confederacy, who already fly a Confederate National Flag (which is also pictured on a sign near chapel on VMFA grounds).
So, this is really all about the battle flag and only the battle flag, which these folks WORSHIP in a scary way. I’m not the only one that thinks that VMFA has done plenty to share information about its ongoing status as memorial park & tell the soldiers' home story. This state agency should focus on what decades of past and present governors, legislators, and citizens want them to do: build and run a world class art museum that, by the way, has free admission to its collections. The commonwealth tore down the soldiers home in 1941 and moved on. Wish these self-absorbed troglodytes would too.

Voice of Reason said...

We support the VMFA decision fully and unequivocally.

Thank you, VMFA, for explaining the background of the situation, which makes perfect sense. That flags did not appear on the chapel prior to 1993 makes one wonder why they were placed there in the first place. We are glad that the board reevaluated the situation and ruled in favor of historical accuracy in the end. It sounds that much care has been given by VMFA to preserving and interpreting the resources, and certainly no more needs to be done. We hope that you will stand firm in that decision, even in the face of a few zealots trying to embarrass you into recanting it. And make no mistake, embarrassment and intimidation is exactly what is implied in the quote above, “We aren't going away. We will be out there in the rain heat and cold. When the tour buses pull in and when the school buses full of kids have their field trips.”

The flagging group represent a sad (but thankfully small) population in the South that validates and celebrates the traitorous actions of those in past the who voluntarily rejected the United States of America to form their own nation - - one based on protecting and preserving the institution of slavery and ensuring that African-Americans were forever considered as less than human. In fact, their ancestors firing on soldiers in the United States Army should be seen as nothing less than domestic terrorism.

This group wears its familial connection to Civil War soldiers as a badge of honor, which begs the question, So what?????? Do you not also have ancestors who fought in other wars, but actually on the side of the United States?

And please try to understand (although to understand takes higher-level thinking that likely eludes this group, so I know that I’m asking a lot here) . . . . the confederate battle flag flew with the goal of establishing a nation that would keep tens of thousands enslaved and treated as property in the 1860s. Then the confederate battle flag was carried by those who blocked and protested the tens of thousands of African-Americans who marched and sought to claim their civil rights in the 1960s. It still can be seen flying from the back of many trucks, with the word “Redneck” emblazoned across (we can assume the obvious from that).

It is a complicated symbol. While there is room for civic discourse on its proper place in modern history, shouting your opinion from a street corner while brandishing a weapon is not the place and time.

The VMFA is right on this issue, legally, historically, and ethically. Thank you, VMFA.

Virginia pride said...

Meant to add that I hope VMFA security and state police are on the alert. The flaggers rhetoric brings out the skinhead/klan faction that would probably damage museum (meaning commonwealth's property)or hurt state employees there to get its point across. Be afraid of these folks. Be very afraid... (And where are the local SCV on this? People easily think they're part of all this-- if they're not, they should say so. And encourage those outsiders to go back to Ga. etc. and let them manage these issues.)

800pound_elephant said...

@Vapride - Excuse me I am not from Georgia. Matter of fact my family was here in RICHMOND Virginia (Fort West) in 1622. How about yours?

We are no way affiliated with skinheads or hate groups like the KKK. How would that be possible when we have a black woman carrying a confederate flag with us on a PUBLIC sidewalk? (which by the way you can't kick us off of)

I could give rip what the UDC or the SCV say about our activities. Hopefully they will say something as the deafness and embarrassment from these organizations are ringing louder than ever.

We are not violent people.. Call all the cops you want. I am a very successful business man with lots of lawyers already prepaid.

Believe me as ever...

Virginia pride said...

800-pounder: Clearly some of the flaggers came from out of state to join in since not enough local folks cared. And it's also clear you don't give a rip about much of anything but your own narrow misconceptions and agenda. (And Hathaway is obviously in love with her own face, based on the way she plasters her pictures all over her self-promoting blogs and facebook.)

My family arrived in York County Va. from England in 1701, their descendants fought with LaFayette in the revolution, and also later with the confederacy, then WW1, WW2, Korea, and Desert Storm. Please don't claim to speak for all Virginians, southerners, descendants of Confederate veterans, or people who love this state and country. You don't. Get a clue: the battle flag doesn't mean squat to the majority of us. How dare you reduce our heritage to that one now tainted emblem?

Who cares what you do on the sidewalk as long as you don't deface property or force yourself on people trying to visit the museum. Knock yourself out. And there are plenty of battle flags and pictures of battleflags inside the chapel if you're needing a place to conduct rituals before your sacred idol. That is if the SCV you belittle here want your kind in there.

800pound_elephant said...

@Vapride - nice personal attacks. I am glad that my comments effect you the way they do. That is a lot of power to give one person. Back to the topic the flag...

I am not speaking for all Virginians so where did you get that crazy point from? Little narcissistic there aren't you?
I am speaking for me. I could careless about you and what you think.

At the end of the day we will still be on the sidewalk with many more flags then used to be tucked away behind the Museum of broken promises and there is not a thing you can do about it.

TrueConfederate said...

I have stood with Susan and others in front of the Museum.
I held the battle flag that my Great Grand Father and his brother followed.
They fought to protect Richmond, and Virginia from an invading army.
They were members of the First Company Richmond Howitzers.
After the war they were both members of the R.E. Lee Camp # 1.
My first ancestor came to VA in 1619, I have had ancestors fight in every war you care to name.
The removal of the flags from the chapel is disgraceful.
How can you claim to promote history, When you take it out of sight?
It’s a long drive from Suffolk VA, but as soon as my health allows I will return.
I will stand on the sidewalk and endure the name calling and fingers from a few of Richmond’s
Proud citizens. Why ? Because I love Virginia! And I know it’s the right thing to do!
Dave Tatum
Suffolk VA

Historic Fan Parks Dot Org said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
TrueConfederate said...

When I read the comments at this site I am not surprised at being called a troglodyte, or being accused of intimidation, that’s par for the course. When you have no understanding of history: you are inclined to call names and make baseless accusations.
@ VA Pride/ I worship God and his son Jesus Christ, I RESPECT the Battle Flag of my Great Grand Father.
@ Voice of Reason / The invasion of the southern states by Lincolns minions who robbed, raped, murdered both white and black inhabitants would seem to fit the definition of terrorist much more accurately. As for preserving Slavery perhaps you should check out what the North had to offer!
Resolved by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled, That the following article be proposed to the Legislatures of the several States as an amendment to the Constitution of the United States, which, when ratified by three-fourths of said Legislatures, shall be valid, to all intents and purposes, as part of the said Constitution, namely:

ART. 13. No amendment shall be made to the Constitution which will authorize or give to Congress the power to abolish or interfere, within any State, with the domestic institutions thereof, including that of persons held to labor or service by the laws of said State. --12 United States Statutes at Large, 36th Congress, 2nd Session, 1861, p. 251.
So if “the confederate battle flag flew with the goal of establishing a nation that would keep tens of thousands enslaved and treated as property in the 1860s” what does the Corwin Amendment say?
As much as you want to believe your own misconceptions they don’t hold up to close examination.
As for the SCV, we are on the sidewalk take time to stop by and speak with us the SCV and UDC are represented in front of the museum.
Take the time to speak with us. You will find we are not what you accuse us of being. And you might just learn something!
Dave Tatum
Suffolk VA.

800pound_elephant said...

Wow historic fan park dot org guy must have hit a nerve. Anytime someone censor's my post I take it as a victory on my point of view.

Why was it deleted? It did not have and vulgar words in it.. It only stated a point and asked questions.

In court there are no post to delete when someone speaks...

Guess Alex didn't like his name being mentioned.

C.C. said...


Virginia pride said...

Just back from 2 hours at VMFA and hope everybody goes to visit and take a very close look like I did. Walk all the way around the grassy spaces and read the different signs about the history of R.E.Lee Camp No.1 soldiers home. There are actually four signs there mentioning the place being a Confederate Memorial Park (yes, a museum and memorial park at same time, how about that.) Don't miss sign and pictures by the chapel about the Confederate National Flag and its three versions. Go in the chapel that the museum maintains and leases to SCV so history can be told further. (They give a good tour there, and great model.) You might even go inside the art museum since it belongs to all of us and find Civil War art, some made by Virginians who fought for the confederacy. Like Moses Ezekeil,a VMI cadet who fought at New Market.

So all the misrepresentations here and elsewhere online about the museum not caring about history, not showing respect, no confederate flags, blah blah, just isn't true. These flaggers' only interest is that VMFA drape the BATTLE flag on the chapel that didn't have flags in soldiers day and to park it any other place they demand.

VMFA stand firm. You're doing a great job with OUR chapel and OUR museum. Time to ignore these folks. Let them march and wave. Useless because there just isn't any there there.

Connie Ward said...

Voice of Reason, you brought it up, so it has to be addressed. If, by traitorous actions, you mean those of the Confederates, you are mistaken. In the Declaration of Independence, Thomas Jefferson established that people are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, and that governments are instituted to secure those rights. One right he specifically identifies is the right of the people to alter or abolish their government and create another that suits them better. This right both pre-exists and transcends the U.S. Constitution. How grotesque, then, that the only time Americans have attempted to exercise this right, the government that was supposed to secure it for them made brutal war on them instead.

The Southern states seceded legally and peacefully, most of them by the vote of delegates to secession conventions, elected by the people at the county level. About seventy-five percent of the population that elected these delegates were not slaveowners or from slaveowning families. There was and remains no federal law prohibiting secession. Secession is not among those powers prohibited to the states in Section 10 of the Constitution. It is not among the power delegated to the federal government by the Constitution.

The U.S. Code identifies treason, rebellion, or insurrection, seditious conspiracy, and advocation of the overthrow of the government as criminal offenses punishable by several years of imprisonment and thousands of dollars in fines. But none of these constitute secession.

Connie Ward said...

Voice of Reason, the issue of slavery was far more complex than your simplistic explanation would have people believe. Slavery figured so prominently in the secession debates and documents because it was an artificially inflated issue. For years, the north and the feds had used slavery as the excuse for victimizing the Southern states in a variety of ways. Abolitionist William Seward, who became Lincoln's Secretry of State, knew this. As early as 1850, in a speech about California statehood, he said, "Every question, political, civil, or ecclesiastical, however foreign to the subject of slavery, brings up slavery as an incident, and the incident supplants the principal question."

MIssissippi's Secession document, which people wave around to "prove" it was all-about, only-about slavery, actually illustrate Seward's words. (They mention security of their citizens, and loss of territory as two reasons why they were seceding. If it was all/only about slavery, why include these reasons?) Gen. Sherman also said that slavery was the pretext of the war, not the cause/reason for it.

First, the idea that the Confederacy was set up to ensure that African-Americans would be **forever** considered as less than human simply isn't true. In fact, the Confederate Constitution included provisions that would have eventually caused the death of slavery in the CSA. First, the prohibition of slave importation except from a place where it basically wasn't allowed to exist, and where importation had already been made illegal. Second, the provision for new states to enter the Confederacy as non-slave states. The Constitution forbade such states from creating laws that would interfere with slavery as it existed in *other* states, but they could have certainly prohibited slavery among their own citizens.

As for Article I, Section 9, Paragraph 4 -- No bill of attainder, ex post facto law, or law denying or impairing the right of property in negro slaves shall be passed -- that applied to the states, i.e., no state law could be passed that impaired the right of propert in negro slaves -- explained in But there's nothing in the Constitution prohibiting Congress from passing such a law for the entire Confederacy; and even if there were, it could have been amended out of existence by Article V, Section I, Paragraph (1).

People who have bought into the evilization of the Confederacy (and most white Southerners to this day) by academia and the popular culture will not see nor accept the significance of these provisions in bringing about the eventual demise of slavery in the CSA. Nevertheless, there they are.

Besides, if slavery was the only issue the South cared about, they could have stayed in the Union and kept it in perpetuity. See, the Corwin Amendment.

Connie Ward said...

Voice of Reason. the Southern states seceded, peacefully and legally. The United States had no business keeping its governmental agencies, revenue collectors and military personnel in the seceded territory . That they did made THEM the aggressors. Lincoln called up 75,000 military volunteers to illegally invade a sovereign nation that had shown no aggression toward the USA -- indeed, that had LEFT it. So the feds sent an army down here that burned towns -- whole towns, dozens of them. They shelled towns that had no military presence in them -- shellings that killed and maimed civilians. Sherman, Sheridan, Butler and Turchin were the worst at making war on civilians -- shooting family pets for fun, burning houses and barns, even farm implements so civilians would have no way to grow food, shooting livestock and throwing the carcasses in wells and streams to contaminate the drinking water and cause disease in a place where medicine to treat it was prohibited by the blockade; stabling horses in church sanctuaries just for spite, and digging up corpses looking for valuables.

That is what Confederate soldiers were fighting, and had every reason to. It was the Union Army, not Confederates, who behaved like terrorists.

Connie Ward said...

Voice of Reason, so what if the flaggers (but by no means only the flaggers) wears their familial connection to Confederate soldiers as a badge of honor? First, doing so in no way diminishes our connection to and pride in ancestors who fought in other wars. I'm particularly proud of my forebears in the Continental Army, and even the ones who weren't military but are considered Colonial Patriots. But since you asked, and in case you haven't noticed, the veterans of other wars are not demonized and lied about like Confederate soldiers. If we stand up for them, correct the lies, honor their sacrifice, what's it to you? Nobody's making you do it.

Connie Ward said...

Voice of Reason, the US flag was also brandished by those who opposed civil rights. Your argument here falls flat. It's unfortunate that some people trivialize the Confederate flag by putting jumping bass and words like "Redneck" on it, but they simply need to be educated. Regarding your comment about the term "Redneck," by the way -- we can assume the obvious? What obvious? What's obvious to me is that the term means different things to different people, and what it means to someone who displays it is NOT always obvious -- in fact, it hardly ever is. What you're doing, then, is not just assuming, but prejudging someone based not on what THEY think/feel about the flag but on what YOU do. You may not be a bigot, but you are certainly exhibiting far more bigoted behavior than the Redneck flying the flag.

Who are you to designate when and where and how people may discourse -- about any thing? And what weapons have the flaggers brandished?

Connie Ward said...

If the north had a claim of moral superiority over the South because some of its states abolished slavery when it became unprofitable, that moral authority was obliterated by northern industry's accumulation of wealth processing slave-grown cotton in its textile mills and its maritime interests' accumulation of wealth shipping slave-grown cotton to Europe. It was obliterated by the wealth accumulated northern banks for financing plantations and slaves, and by northern insurance companies for insuring slaves.

It was obliterated by the military invasion of the Southern states, the barbarity with which the Union Army made war and the economic enslavement of the Southern people, black and white, for generations after the war, with purposely created poverty.

The claim of U.S. moral superiority was obliterated by the U.S. government's official policy of genocide of the Plains Indians; by herding native Americans into federal concentration camps artfully referred to as "reservations" in conditions worse than slavery; by the internment of Japanese Americans in WWII; by the Tuskegee Syphilis experiments; by the CIA's mind control/drug experiments at home and torture and murder in Central America; by Abu Ghraib. Shall I continue?

Connie Ward said...

Virginia pride, you need to change your name to Virginia shame because what you're doing is shameful -- attributing potential violence to peaceful protesters, You could be setting them up to be attacked, you know. Would that please you if it happened? (See how wrongly attributing to someone the desire for violence works? Not fun, is it?)

Now. Please identify the rhetoric of the flaggers that brings out the skinhead/klan faction. And please identify the dates/times when skinhead/klan factions have been brought out to these protests.

And do try to come up with a less hackneyed cliche. Be afraid, be very afraid? Oh, please.

Connie Ward said...

Virginia pride wrote, "And it's also clear you don't give a rip about much of anything but your own narrow misconceptions and agenda. (And Hathaway is obviously in love with her own face, based on the way she plasters her pictures all over her self-promoting blogs and facebook.)"

That is not clear. You'd have to be omniscient to make such a judgment based on some posts in a comment thread. What is much clearer is that you have a tendency toward ad hominem attacks and bigotry....

If the people you're criticizing don't speak for all Virginians and Southerners, etc., why, neither do you. I'd like to see some documentation that "the battle flag doesn't mean squat to the majority of us." Otherwise, it's simply your opinion, which is monumentally dismissable.

FireEater said...

Connie,I think virginia pride has her tail tucked because she can't argue with any of the well stated points you just made. They can't back up anything factually,only with that tingly stuff running up Chris Mathews leg.
Good job!!!!!!

Maya's Garden Party said...

VMFA you have my full support on this issue. I doubt that many people who share the views of the "flaggers" are or ever would be on your member, visitor or donor rosters anyway, and I believe that reasonable people/casual observers have grown tired of the type of bullying behavior being shown by the flaggers. Keep your chin up - this too shall pass.

0c083e64-0edf-11e1-a2f6-000bcdcb5194 said...

These flag people obviously have nothing better to do, and spend their time waiting for responses so they can fire off a reply. The VMFA is doing the right thing EXCEPT for not removing the spam they repeatedly post on the VMFA FB page. FB rules say not to post the same thing over & over, so these offenders should be reported and banned from further posting. Stand on the street & shout yourself hoarse. Tattoo a rebel flag on your forehead (to match the one on your arm), put it on your hound-dogs sweater, hang it in the back of you pickup-truck's window (under the gun rack), get a doormat with it, paste it on the back of your motorcycle helmet, but you all are truly deranged if you think a state owned/run/operated piece of land is ever gonna let it fly. Supporters of VMFA need to post their support on FB more. I'm tired of seeing the good ole boys taking over.

Wendy Martin said...

I have given tours at the VMFA for 19 years, am thrilled to live just one block from one of the top ten comprehensive art museums in the nation and support the VMFA unequivocally.

To paraphrase Lincoln: “[235] years ago our fathers brought forth on this continent, a new nation, conceived in Liberty, and dedicated to the proposition that all men are created equal. [146 years ago we were] engaged in a great civil war, testing whether that nation, or any nation so conceived and so dedicated, can long endure.” Thank God the Civil War is over, “this nation, under God, … [had] a new birth of freedom -- and that government of the people, by the people, for the people, [did] not perish from the earth.”

The Union’s “Stars & Stripes” flag endures as the symbol of this great nation; it represents all Americans.

VMFA does an admirable job of maintaining the Confederate Chapel. I believe it interprets the history of the VMFA grounds respectfully and accurately. I also believe that HandsOn Greater Richmond ( is an outstanding resource for passionate people who seek meaningful volunteer opportunities that will improve the quality of life in this region.

kindredblood said...

Stand firm are in the right. Don't let the Lost Cause Traditionalists push you around or trample on you property rights. So you removed some least the shrine to R. E. Lee is still there. They should be content with that. If they complain any more I would start displaying Gay & Lesbian art inside the chapel...

Stan said...

Maya's Garden Party makes the point that none of the flaggers, or those that maintain their views, would ever be doners to the VMFA. I beg to differ ma'am! The land on which the VMFA is built was DONATED by the SCV Lee Camp! Museums are to hold dear the things of the past so future generations can can learn from it! When the Lee Camp donated the land for the VMFA, their decision was based on this premise. Truth has been replaced with Political Correctness and the distortions that agenda brings with it. Connie Ward, and other supporters of the flaggers, have done a marvelous job of returning the discussion to that of TRUTH!

Virginia pride said...

Stan, just like so many of the flaggers you make up things to suit your argument. Last spring Historic Richmond sponsored a historian who gave a great program at the chapel. SCV did not donate the land. The RE Lee camp board gave the deed to the commonwealth in the 1890s inexcchange for financial help since they couldn't afford to run the place. The state leased it back until the last old soldier died in the 1940s. But I know you're not interested in the TRUTH (all caps, right?).

Daughter of the south said...

I don't have a confederate flag hanging anywhere in my house. I do not use one as window curtains or on my wall as artwork. We don't have one hanging on a tree in the front yard. There is one in the garage, but it isn't hanging anywhere. It is folded up and properly stored away, protected from dirt and dust and the elements. We own a pick up but it does not have a flag in it either. The gun rack in it is used not for guns, but for my husband's canes. He is a disabled vet that gave 10 years of his life in the USMC so these people can have the freedom to spout such trash about us. We don't own any guns. We have 4 dogs, but no hounds. Our small dogs couldn't be more un-redneck or un-manly. They do not have confederate flags on their winter sweaters. We do not have a deer head over the fireplace. We do not hunt. My husband has never supported the idea of killing for sport and is very sensitive to helpless innocent animals. Neither me or my husband even have a tattoo, although at almost 60 years of age he has talked about getting one...but of Jesus rising from the tomb, not of a Confederate flag. He does have a motorcycle, and it does have a small confederate flag sticker on it but not on his helmet; and the one on the bike is not blatantly obvious. I can barely stand to ride on it because it terrifies me. We attend church regularly. My husband will likely become a deacon next year. He is in college and plans to attend seminary. His son was just ordained as a catholic priest this week. I am college educated and have a great job with the state. We are not what anyone would consider to be a "good ole boy". My husband's passion is art, and he is a fantastic artist. Until this came up, he was a member of the VMFA and so was my daughter. But we no longer support them. My hobbies and interests include antique shopping, museums (all except the VMFA), and photography. We love Virginia history. One of my favorite places to be is in a library. We are not nazis, kkk, skin heads, or rednecks. We could not be further from what that prejudiced, uneducated individual described as a person who supports the Confederate flag. But we do support it 100%, and the TRUE causes for which several of my great-grandathers fought; one of my great-grandfathers died in battle; one of my great-grandfathers was a POW and died in a Yankee "concentration camp" at the hands of your righteous yankee ancestors; and one of my husband's great-grandfathers was a POW. So, to those who see us as anything else, I give you the "You're number one" sign with the middle finger.

Kathryn Henry-Choisser said...
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Kathryn Henry-Choisser said...
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Virginia pride said...

News flash!
Plenty of people get it:
“The problem with Hathaway’s argument, as well as the rest of the so-called “Southern Heritage” defenders, is the self-righteous nature of their own rhetoric. It is disingenuous on the part of Hathaway and others to frame this specific case as a defense of the memory of Confederate veterans as if they alone have a monopoly on what that entails. The VMFA has spent a great deal of money maintaining the grounds and even interpreting the structure for those interested. It seems to me that the museum has done much more to preserve the city’s Confederate heritage/history than anything Hathaway and others can accomplish by “flagging”.”
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